This is awesome. Would definitely download a local higher-res version if that were an option, maybe using Google Street View data? Also, if this was a live MMO, that would be fun. Not that there's really a game aspect here other than the coins when driving a vehicle, but anything to give some life to the sim SF city would be nice.
Seemingly lower-hanging fruit options I'd like to see:
- show street names, maybe some landmarks or businesses, togglable
- enter address to teleport to
- enter address to get directions to, GPS style, to travel there manually
- get coordinates / current location as a URL to share
- zoom in on minimap, or expand minimap, so that teleporting can be more precise
There is so much scope with maps! All we need is a realtime-ish image model to tidy up the scene. (was looking into it during a recent side project - https://sf.isopolis.city/).
I lived in SF for nearly 20 years, though I mostly spend my time in New York now.
And genuinely this made me emotional. Was weird as hell walking around my back yard. Going to the spot in Dolo that I used to haunt in my 20s. My favorite tennis courts and hill bombs, walked the entire disc golf course, etc.
Happy to hear someone else say this. Similar story. I could never live in SF again but roaming around it was nostalgic in a way going back now just isn't
yeah SF is one of the capitals, if not THE capital of NIMBYism.
SF needs to relax zoning codes and shift to land value tax (just like any city), but of course that will never happen
The local baker increases their prices because their lease drastically went up. The reason their leases went up is because inventory is low due to NIMBY regulations.
Same. I lived in SF for 15 years, my kids were toddlers in the Marina... this is so freaking awesome and really brings out the nostalgia! It matches my memories exactly.
Exact proportions are crazy. I had the reverse experience doing sim racing... do a track a bunch, finally visit it in person - and it looks the exact same as in your mind.
I’m a ‘serious’ sim racer and I’m gonna get the chance to drive a touring car at BTCC brands hatch in October. I’ve sim raced that layout a million times I’m very excited to experience this. Already had a weird enough feeling at Laguna Seca without driving it!
This made me super nostalgic as well. I've lived in NYC for 20 years, but spent a ton of time in SF early in my career (starting in 2008). I love NYC, but I've been sort of feeling like a change lately and this made me feel like subletting a place for a few months and getting back to the slower pace of SF.
The free will of walking. I walked around the city using certain routes, and I can freely replicate those walks in this. I did walks I did when my kids were 3 years old. Google Maps isn't fluid enough to do this.
Honestly it’s a good question. obviously a big part is walking through it. But I also think it’s because it’s this weird, dreamlike version. Because it’s low res and a little broken, it’s like walking through a place you know really well in a dream. Little truths pop up, like a certain taqueria right where you expect it. But it’s almost a Silent Hill version of the town, so your mind fills in the blanks for you.
Maybe this is a common experience, but the first time I left SF for six months, I would have these sort of flashbulb memories of certain intersections and locations. Not even particular memories there. I think because I moved there right out of college and my late adolescence and all that it entails took place there, there are a hundred little corners where I’ve got a thousand more memories.
It being like a half-remembered scene particularly triggers the nostalgia. Also probably because I’m not there right now.
I have dreamed about a pipeline that can take elevation data, building data, maps, and streetview imagery to process a city into all the components you would need to build a proper map for one of the GTA engines, including all the other objects like trees, fire hydrants, signs, light posts, traffic lights, etc.
The building textures could be recreated from the low-res streetview imagery using a pipeline to scale / relight them using image-to-image models. Building shapes could be rebuilt using generative models for 3d mesh components. Road & sidewalk quality (how clean, how faded lines are, etc) could be inferred from imagery as well to be applied to the map.
Super cool project, hoping it continues to evolve!
Finally got round to vibe coding something in Godot this summer for my city. It used GeoTIFFs on AWS S3 at s3://copernicus-dem-30m/ for elevation. No authentication required, each tile covers 1°×1°. Combined this with OpenStreetMap. Was enough to get started and satisfy curiosity. As you state, lots more that could be done.
GTA games require a lot of effort outside of this, but the concept of mass-producing a GTA style open world game for any given environment is very compelling. Probably frightening to Rockstar themselves but such is the course of technological development.
I've long wanted to make a fun milsim game using 3D map and environmental data, pretty much since the moment I tried out Google Earth VR in 2019. I'm not passionate enough about it to do it on my own, but if anyone else ever gets taken by the idea and wants to make it happen, I'm game.
'Vette was a racing game from the 90's (I think?) that covered San Francisco. "Released on 3 floppy disks", ha ha. Obviously without the rich dataset we have now. (Clicking on the following link ignores the trailing exclamation point in MacOS Safari for me.) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vette!
I did a voxel (ray casting) lunar lander that used actual NASA moon data (https://mooncraft2000.com).
Man, I just posted this same comment. 'Vette was the first thing I thought of. Ever since playing it way back then, I wanted a better SF open world game.
How does this work? What data is it pulling? It seems like it's made of Gaussian splats, but the creator says it comes from Apple data. What Apple data? Is Apple making Gaussian splat data available?
I feel like we're not too far away from someone taking street view photographs and aerial photographs and feeding them into a multimodal LLM that is able to construct intuitive meshes with textures that are independent of lighting... surely there are people working on this problem right now?
Very amazing. And this is the worst it will ever be. We'll soon be exploring 4k versions of this and we can open every trash can in Tunis. Fascinating. Had a lot of fun (tedious tho) going out to Alcatraz and figuring out how to get in.
Ah nice demo! I flew around SF for way too long just enjoying the sights. On my M3 Air using Chrome it eventually just turns into blobs and my character get stuck, takes about twenty minutes. I popped open the DevTools and the game loads in at like 400mb but after five or so minutes I'm at 2GB of memory consumption. I'd guess that you need to have your agent do a couple of passes for memory leaks. Very fun otherwise!
Similar concept, but more abstract in terms of art style. I'm pretty close to having the foundation I wanted before adding quests on top; telling a story is the ultimate goal.
Building on top of GIS data is super fun though. Especially since the barrier to entry is so low these days with LLMs. I encourage everyone to give it a shot if your local town/city publishes some data. No need to understand coordinate systems for example, which is nice.
For the game, there's a button to get in without an account so you can play around, but to get the fun mods you will need to play a bit and figure out the trash pick up/scrap at dump mechanic in the game.
(*might be a bit of lag; server needs more ram but on vacation rn!)
It took a little while because I was struggling with the scale a little bit at first, but I found my house. I appreciate that you tore 95 and 676 out! Keep it up - consistent art direction usually beats hyper-realism, for me, and I appreciate the bizarro world you've concocted.
Awesome! If you click the top left 'Mode' switch and go to Property, you can buy it :) you just have to pick up and scrap enough trash to get the $5k for it.
I do think 95 and 676 will be in the game more accurately eventually. But it will match the style of the rest of the game. It's a work in progress now but not good enough to ship yet. Love that you said bizarro, feels like i'm on the right track
This was so much fun! Some feedback - I wish the highways were more accurate, seems like a limitation of how elevation is handled on these maps. The navigation line was really hard to see since it was at camera level. It was hard to tell what direction i was going, the minimap and the large map seemed to disagree.
Hey, thanks. You're pretty much right about highways. I do have a separate working branch that has actual raised highways, but I'm still figuring out the kinks in making it look nice and joining the terrain correctly. Generating accurate entrance/exit ramps has proven to be my kryptonite but I'll get it eventually. I will give the minimap some love when I get back too-- thanks for checking it out
This is excellent! Wish it had more of the surrounding area, and the announcements are all queued/delayed, but still lots of fun. Love the style as well
Is this ripped using the retroplasma flyover-reverse-engineering code? The retroplasma repo is a bit behind now and doesn’t work with the updated way Apple serves map data and the heif texture format.
I’ve been playing with the same thing to make RC tracks in re-volt (or rather RVGL). This game though, running the game as a webpage is fantastic!
Looks to me like a weird combination; maybe the spat is trained off ripped Apple Maps data? The surface textures all look static like traditional photogrammetry (e.g. no specularity), but there are definite splat artifacts rendered.
Actually, ripping the data might not be required with this approach; instead the splat could be trained with a screen recording of normal Apple Maps usage.
Interesting, it does definitely look like the ground is just a mesh. Also, it looks like apple maps has actually recently started using some sort of splatting - I wonder if their implementation is entirely splatted, or if it is this exact weird combination.
Do you have coordinates for where splatting is used in Apple Maps?
It does seem like an obvious next step towards realistic maps, could be difficult with weather conditions changing during capture. A brute force approach though could be 1000 drones to do capture simultaneously.
This is awesome and if it's legal I'd love to do similar things on geospatial projects I work on. However I don't think Apple will be OK with this use of their data. I know that Google closely limits its 3D tiles data through a specific API and Apple does not make a 3d API available, therefore this has to be against ToS.
From the ToS linked from OP site:
> 1.3 Restrictions. You will not and will not permit or authorize a third party to: (...) (xiv) decompile, decrypt, reverse engineer, attempt to derive the source code of or disassemble the Service or any portion thereof (except as and only to the extent this restriction is prohibited by applicable law or by licensing terms governing the use of any FOSS components that may be included with the Service)
I would love for people to prove me wrong that Apple will embrace this use of their geospatial data!
This would maybe be a pretty good opportunity to use some of that "upscaling" AI tech: given this weird results of spatial scanning, produce something plausible and much higher definition. There are some dangers of doing so, of course. People will believe details that show up in it because it's taken from real life, and AI loves adding fake details, but for a little game it seems like detail beats ground truth.
Kinda funny game, though if you want a bit more fidelity, but less control, Microsoft Flight Simulator has a pretty good version of SF.
Though as for games that use SF (but not 1:1) Watch Dogs 2 is a pretty good proxy, though my favorite video game interpretation of San Francisco is from GTA San Andreas (San Fierro)
Very impressed with the Watch Dogs series of games for this purpose.
We recently used Watch Dogs Legion to prep for a trip to London to get more familiar with the city. Set the game on peaceful mode and just walked around and did virtual sight-seeing instead of playing missions. It's a surprisingly good recreation of the city, and we really appreciated getting some familiarity with the place before we visited.
I did a similar thing for the UK when prepping to drive around. I hooked my steering wheel up to Forza Horizon 4, and just drove slow cars on the wrong side of the road through Edinburgh, following as many of the road laws as I knew.
It wasn't perfect, but it did help a little. The streets are way narrower, and the traffic is much worse, but muscle memory to stay on the left side of the road was nice.
I do adore San Andreas but I think San Fierro is one of the weakest areas. My metric for how accurate they are is a sense of "oh I've been here before" and I really only get that in a couple of spots, as compared to Las Venturas (Las Vegas) and Los Santos (Los Angeles) where I could actually go to the cities in real life and feel like I knew where I was going because I'd played San Andreas enough. Compared to those two, San Fierro feels like a Backrooms-style dreamlike compression of the real thing, where a lot of stuff has been moved around. But parts of Haight-Ashbury, Pac Heights, Nob/Russian Hill, Polk Gulch, Ocean Beach and so on are still fairly distinguishable and correctly arranged.
Ha, Microsoft Flight Simulator is the most uncanniest valley thing I think I've ever played with; I'm from Tallahassee and it's weird to fly around a very high-fidelity, realistic, inaccurate version of a city I've lived in my entire life.
That was actually Watchdogs 2. Great game, basically GTA but you are a hacker in the Bay Area. The SF portion of the map was accurate down to every building.
If that second link is an in-game map, it is far from accurate to the real world. Unless it’s from a timeline in which Golden Gate Park is connected to the Presidio, and half of SF has fallen into the ocean.
Have you thought of going to the SF DBI to get the indoor blueprints and digitizing them for even more experience? I wonder how good GPT Sol would do at scraping photos to apply to the blueprints one of some streaming geojson+bitmap or something.
This is incredible, I wish I could have this in my city.
Can’t help but wondering, how will this look like if we had AI try to “augment” these maps in real time (maybe using street view images?). I wonder if it would be playable in reasonable FPS, and how expensive it would be.
silly question from someone who's never played fps: how do you get the camera to face the way the player is moving? For me the camera is always facing the same way, so if the player is walking toward the camera I can only see behind him?
I'm sitting here watching the block bounce in a circle and I have no idea if the game is actually loading or not. Tried turning off PopUpOff. Tried turning off adblock.
as it turns out it just isn't loading (firefox on win 11, if that matters)
Beware, safari users. This locks up safari on my recent macbook pro and you cant close the window to clear it. Restarting safari doesnt help, the tab immediately freezes the app upon start. Holding shift while restarting safari doesnt help. Currently trying to figure out a way.
It always seemed a missed opportunity that Microsoft Flight Simulator doesn't have a UFO mode or something where you don't need to worry about the physics of keeping the plane in the air and could just stop and look at things.
Maybe you don't need real-ish physics for the glider here. Does the user really need to fall?
my first experience with San Francisco in a video game was through the City Escape stage in Sonic Adventure 2. and I didn't even know then that it was San Francisco (I had never been there when I played the game). only realized this when I visited the city many years later.
At some point someone will integrate actual interactive models of buildings and houses, based on Zillow pictures and whatnot, and then the entire thing will be interactive in a disturbing way
I feel like I did that walk, in person (the tourist areas for sure). I've been to SF three times now, most of the time I'm walking everywhere. Even found a place that sells Brazilian coxinha
funny timing, i was exploring the same, some friends and me play alot of geogussr (a game where you put into streetview somewhere on the world, and have to find out where) lately.
I want to make it more video game like, cause the jumps of google maps make me motion sick.
I used google streetview as image source (cause you need to read signs, cars, see geometry) and colmap to reconstruct 3d chunks.
But it never really worked that well, jumps in time (cause the google car does not always continuously scan) and the image density is just too low, but was a fun side project.
This was loads of fun haha. I would have liked to have optionally clicked a button and started at my current physical location because the tile load time dominated how long it took to get there.
I was able to get it to stand directly on the roof of the structure I'm sitting at. (Which is kind of a glitch, it walked right over the structure as if it's a hill.)
When I noticed it getting choppy I realized I had filled most of my VRAM with an LLM, so I unloaded that and it got better.
Looks like an atmospheric explorer kinda thing. Low-poly SF where you can just wander around and take in the city, pretty chill. I dunno, I really enjoyed it
Back in the 90's, there was a game called "Midtown Madness" by Microsft. They simulated SF and London very well. This game now takes it to another level.
Came here to say this - I have fond memories of playing Midtown Madness 2 as a kid (IIRC it came bundled with our new Windows ME family PC). I remember when I had the chance to visit SF in 2005 and I would recognize so many of the streets from playing the game. Good times.
When I was in SF the first time some spots seemed weirdly familiar to me. Only later that day I remembered that I probably know them from GTA San Andreas (but maybe also the Full House intro)
It is fun when you play a game based on a place, then visit the place. There have been a few places that I've been to that were levels of the Tony Hawk series. I enjoyed how the game designers were able to take what was otherwise pretty mundane, and tweak it into a fun map, while not just making it all up and losing the source location.
It won't be a solid hit until you can do your civic doody on the sidewalks yourself.
There's a rich fertile tradition of "First Person Poopers", some of them quite regular, long-running, corny, or impactful.
Natural Selection 2: Combat -- Rock Paper Shotgun's literal headline: "First-Person Pooper: Swallowed Alive In NS2 Combat". You get devoured by an Onos and can fight your way through "the finale of the digestion process. All from an appalling first-person view. What great guts!" You don't poop — you ARE the poop.
>"We want players to feel not only horrified at the idea of being eaten alive but that even after being devoured, there's still a chance to destroy the beast and stay alive!" director and sound designer Thomas Loupe told RPS.
Zoo Tycoon 2 -- Eurogamer on its first-person Zookeeper Mode, where you personally clean up after the animals: "The fact it turns the game into the world's first first-person pooper-scoop-'em-up is just an added bonus."
Sploot -- first-person seagull bombing simulator. Boing Boing: "Poop on everyone as a beautiful seagull." Pro tip from the review: "if you fly in low you can almost always make a very personal deposit."
Pooper Scooper -- asymmetric first-person dog-vs-human PvP: "The Dog must collect meat in order to drop slippery poops throughout each map while the Human must collect all of the poops before the time runs out."
Pooper Scooper (2009, iOS, a completely different game) -- you are Zookeeper Zeke, frantically shoveling animal "products" into a waiting tractor. "No time to dally - there is poop to scoop!" Delisted from the App Store, but archived:
(Zeke has been the canonical zookeeper name since Taito's 1982 arcade game Zoo Keeper.)
Party Pooper -- Ludum Dare 40 entry representing the abstinence branch of the genre: "Drink as much alcohol as possible! (without pooping on yourself)"
And of course Reverse Pac-Man, the mathematically pure form: traverse the maze depositing the dots instead of eating them.
So the First Person Pooper design space spans pooping, being pooped on, becoming poop, scooping poop, weaponizing poop, and heroically holding it in. A deep fast moving genre.
This was a fantastic game. Having been entranced by flight simulators for years, I found the San Francisco terrain in "Vette!" to be fantastic and very engrossing. It was a very "open world" game that wasn't as atrocious as GTA. (Although you could apparently run over pedestrians and tangle with the cops!)
It was not multi-player but just a leisurely, offline, fast-rendering racing game. Very, very enjoyable for an 18-year-old kid!
The hardest to believe most unrealistic scene in The Room was when he conveniently found a parking spot right in front of the flower shop, and he doesn't even get parking ticket, right before the "Oh, hi doggie!" scene.
Seemingly lower-hanging fruit options I'd like to see:
- show street names, maybe some landmarks or businesses, togglable
- enter address to teleport to
- enter address to get directions to, GPS style, to travel there manually
- get coordinates / current location as a URL to share
- zoom in on minimap, or expand minimap, so that teleporting can be more precise
- changeable avatar
- more dynamic weather / lighting options
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